Gnomes of Jade Forest

[Kevin]

I also just realized something, I really have no cavalry in this faction.  I might have to make the Satyrs cavalry.  We'll see.  Maybe being cavalry-less is ok. Not really sure.

Neither the Lizardmen nor the Umenzi have cavalry.  I'd say it's better to go without than to try to force it.  And cavalry units all involve one creature riding another, so unless the Satyrs are riding something, I'd say to keep them as is.


 

One thing that stood out was the cost of the Druid Initiates, which was 260.  Looking at the unit itself at the time we played, they where basically Bowmen with the addition of the Vines and Thorns ability.  They had a good defensive stat at 2/1 and a relatively beefy stat bar at 3/4/2, but they also had a courage of 11 and a range of 10.5.  So take away the Vines and Thorns and I'm guessing they would be in the 170 point range.  Meaning the Vines and Thorns ability itself costs about 90 points for this unit which is miles beyond what it really should cost.  Especially since the ability is next to useless vs. engaged attacks.

I priced these.  Perhaps I misread the unit, but the way they work is that you make an attack at (4) 5/5 and then you do an additional 1 point and they slow down if you'd done at least one, yes?

The Formula bases everything on attacking a 2/2 unit.  This means that (4) 5/5 will average exactly 1 point, so doing an extra damage almost doubles this.  (It would exactly double, except that sometimes you miss.)   So I priced the unit as though it had either 7 or maybe 7.5 dice--the slowdown is worth something as well.

Could be I'm a bit high, but yes, it'll be expensive.

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Here's my 2 cents on the Command Cards, FWIW:

Coordinated Effort - Awesome flavor!  Feels slightly weak - maybe lose the courage bump but have it not count as playing a card?

Make Your Escape - Ordniarily this would be a very nice card.  One thing makes me antsy, though:  There's a special place in Hell for units which get a low price because of a weakness, then the faction is given a command card which exactly nixes this weakness.  An example is Carthaginian Elephants, whose 11 courage makes them really cheap...but then they are given two auto-pass cards (on top of 4 other courage-boosters), meaning that the 11 courage almost never actually has an effect.  Anyway, the combination of Acrobats--whose auto-rally was cheap because they were likely to die while routing anyway--and this card strikes me as open to similar abuse.

Mirror Image - Good flavor, but a bit overpowered.  Generally situational cards such as these give +1/+1 in the good situation, and something less otherwise.  Maybe a parry with an extra +1/+0 when pinched?

Reverse Reality. - I'd make the stat switch mandatory. 

True Focus - Overpowered.  Would probably work OK without the "change to a 1" thing at all.  Or maybe keep that and drop the bonus to (-1) +2/0 and change one damage die to a 2 rather than a 1 (in a hat tip to Ravenwood).

[gornhorror]

As usual, thanks for your comments Kevin.  I made some changes to the command cards with your suggestions in mind.  I also changed the Vines and Thorns ability to better reflect the factions theme of defense.  It no longer deals an automatic damage point but alters the target's attack dice.   Hopefully this will chop some of the price off of the Druids, and Arch Druids.

[gornhorror]

Here are some of the changes after play-testing and some people's comments.

Gnome Tricksters (core) (4) 5/3 3/0 R-0 C-11 M-3.5”
Stat Bar 3/4/2 (Displacement)
Point cost: 93

Gnome Rogues (core) (5) 5/4 3/0 R-0 C-12 M-3.5”
Stat Bar 3/4/2 (Displacement)
On the charge turn Gnome Rogues gain (+0) +1/+1 with flank or rear attacking
Point cost: 143

Gnome Defenders (core) (5) 5/5 3/1 R-0 C-13 M-3.5”
Stat Bar 3/5/2 (Displacement)
Point cost: 208

Gnome Acrobats (core) (5) 6/4 3/0 R-0 C-11 M-5”
Stat Bar 3/3/2 (Displacement)
This unit suffers no movement penalty for sideways or backwards movement.
If this unit routs it automatically reforms at the end of the turn.
This unit gains +2/+0 when it routs and gains (+1) 0/0 against routing units.
Point cost: 167

Ranger Squad (core) (4) 6/5 2/1 R-10.5” C-12 M-5”
Stat Bar 4/3/2 (Displacement)
Range attack is line of sight.
This unit gains +1/+0 against ranged attacks.
Point cost: 234

Druids (core) (4) 5/5 2/1 R-14" C-12 M-3.5”
Stat Bar 3/3/3 (Displacement)
This unit gets -2/-2 when engaged
This unit may move through forests without penalty
Point cost: 220

Unit ability:

Vines and Thorns: If this unit damages another unit with it's ranged attack, place either a vines or a thorns counter on that unit.  During that units next movement and command phase remove that counter for one of the following effects:

Vines: Target unit gets -1 MC until end of turn.
Thorns: Target unit gets (-1) 0/0 until end of turn.

Giant Slug (large/fearsome/elite) (5) 4/6 0/4 R-0 C-14 M-2.5”
Stat Bar 4/4/3
Giant slug regenerates one damage during your movement and command phase.
Point cost: 228

Owlbears (large/fearsome) (5) 6/6 2/3 R-0 C-13 M-5”
Stat Bar: 4/6/2
Confusion: Any unit engaged this unit's front side must discard a command card to play a command card.  You must discard a command card to play a command card on this unit.
Point cost: 338

Satyrs (4) 6/5 2/2 R-14” C-13 M-3.5*”(5" when final rushing)
Ranged attack is line of sight.
Heath Bar: 3/3/2 (Displacement)
This unit gains (+1) +0/+1 +0/+1 when charging
Point cost: 312

Pixies (5) 5*/5* 3/0 R-7” C-11 M-3.5” (7” flying)
Stat Bar 2/2/2 (Displacement)
Ranged attack is line of site.
Pixies get (-1) -1/-2 when engaged.
Pixies may fire poison arrows 3 times during a battle. This occurs during the pila attack stage.  Mark off a poison arrow icon each time a ranged attack is made. For every damage done with their ranged attack target gets (-1) 0/0 for the remainder of the turn.
Point cost: 154

Arch-Druid (unique*) (4) 6*/6* 2/1 R-17.5” C-14 M-3.5”
Stat Bar 3/3/3 (Displacement)
This unit gets -2/-2 when engaged
This unit may move through forests without penalty
*You can only have one of these units in any army.
Point cost: 440
 
Unit ability:

Vines and Thorns: If this unit damages another unit with it's ranged attack, place either a vines or a thorns counter on that unit.  During that units next movement and command phase remove that counter for one of the following effects:

Vines: Target unit gets -1 MC until end of turn.
Thorns: Target unit gets (-1) 0/0 until end of turn.

Spell:

Ram of the Unicorn: Instead of it's normal engaged attack this unit may make an attack at a (2) 7/6 with an impact hit.  This can be done only once per engagement.  This attack may not occur on the charge turn.

Gnome Illusionists (Elite) (3) 5/4 3/0 R-14*” C-13 M-3.5”
Stat Bar 3/3/3 (Displacement)
Point cost: 159

Unit ability:
Blur: This unit may disengage after the first combat round with any unit.  At the end of the combat round, you may disengage this unit by moving it in reverse up to 6".  You must then set it's orders to Disrupted. When backing up this unit it must keep it's current facing.

Spell:
Color Spray:  During your movement and command phase, and if unengaged, illusionists may cast color spray.  Choose a target and roll a die.  Target gains one of the following until end of turn:

1- (-1) -1/+0 +0/+0
2- (-1) +0/-1 +0/+0
3- (-1) +0/+0 -1/+0
4- (-1) +0/+0 +0/-1
5- (-1) and -2 courage
6- Casting Players Choice
*****************************************************************************************
Army ability: Displacement

Spend a command action to check the Displacement box.   While the Displacement box is checked this unit gets (-2) +0/+0 +1/+0 when charging and being charged. When this unit takes two or more damage during an engaged attack you may erase this mark to prevent one damage.  Erasing this mark counts as playing a command card.


Here are some of the command cards that I thought up.  There are two of each.  The wording of the cards in some cases will have to be improved, but I'm sure every body will get the idea.

Coordinated Effort---Play during your movement and command phase.  One ranged unit and one engaged unit gain (+1) 0/0 until end of turn.  If they attack the same enemy unit this turn, the engaged unit gains and additional (+1) 0/0.  This does not count as playing a command card on either unit.

Make Your Escape---Play when one of your units fails a pre-combat courage check or a rout check.  Give target attacking unit (-3) 0/0 on it’s post rout free attacks.

Mirror Image---Play this card before your opponent rolls to hit.  Give your defending unit +2/+0 this attack.   If this unit is pinched this turn, this unit gains two free yellow hit boxes until end of turn.  Do any damage done in the yellow to these boxes first.

Reverse Reality---Reverse the defensive stats of one of your units before your opponent rolls to attack.  You may also change one of your opponents attack rolls to a 6 either on the roll to hit or the roll to damage.

True Focus---One of your units gets (-1) +2/+0 this attack.  In addition you may lower one die by 2 when you roll to damage.

[Kevin]

Vines & Thorns:  I'm guessing you meant "decrease," not "increase."

[gornhorror]

Vines & Thorns:  I'm guessing you meant "decrease," not "increase."

No, I meant increase.....I think.   Heh.

Also, I pretty much altered most of the faction cards, but I did not change "Make Your Escape".  I don't think it's as big as a problem as the Carth Elephants because there are no courage boosters in this faction and there are only two of this particular card.  I wanted to make a card that nerfed the free attack without the benifit of a courage boost. 

[Kevin]

Vines & Thorns:  I'm guessing you meant "decrease," not "increase."

No, I meant increase.....I think.

Why would you ever want to give your opponent more attack dice?  Is this a demoralizer thing?  "You suck so much that instead of slowing your down I'm going to super-charge your units and still kick your arse!"   


Are you sure you didn't mean to say something like...

This attack happens at the beginning of the combat phase.  Your opponent gets (-1) -0/-0 this turn and -1 MC next turn.

That's 99% similar (the only difference being vs. javelin/pila throwers, and engaged opponents who kill your unit this turn) and hugely simpler.

[gornhorror]

Ah, I mean you could increase the value of ONE of the attack dice to hit or to damage.

Example: one of the dice rolled to hit is a 4, you could change it to a 5.

Sorry I wasn't clear.  It was changed in the text.

[Kevin]

Ah!  Got it!

[gornhorror]

Kevin,

How much more would the Druids be if I made their range 14"? 

Just curious.  The 10.5" seems a bit weak in my play-test games. If making them 14" doesn't increase the cost too much I would consider changing them. 

[Kevin]

They go to 242 (from 220).  I'm a bit nervous that their price didn't increase proportionately to how much better V&T will get, but if they really feel weak now that might be OK.

[gornhorror]

Well, thanx for the info Kevin.  I think the 10.5" range is just fine.  I wouldn't want this unit to go to 242 points.  Overall, the range does seem weak, but I think I can live with it.

One more thing.  If I just made the Pixies a straight (5) 4/4 3/0 without any engagment penalties, what would their cost be? 

FYI-  They now have only 3 shots, then they must land if they want to fight. Please see the added benifit of the poison arrows.  It now has a small effect.

[BubblePig]

How do you determine precedence of pixie poison damage vs archers or spell users?

[gornhorror]

Well, to be honest Ron, I don't.

It's a fantasy faction and I'm making stuff up and hoping it works.  That's basically it.  I've played the army 2 times so far and it seems to be pretty fun.  I went 1 for 1.  I will be bringing the proxies to Dexcon next week and hopefully I will be able to play it against some people.  If anybody want's to play the faction and see how it works, they can be my guest.   

[Kevin]

If I just made the Pixies a straight (5) 4/4 3/0 without any engagment penalties, what would their cost be?

So you're saying that their bowfire is only skill 4?  Seems kind of pathetic.

i'll have to get back to you on this when I figure out how the hell I priced the pixies.  I may have changed their cost after giving them to you.  Can you remind me what their stats were when I priced them?

How do you determine precedence of pixie poison damage vs archers or spell users?

Good catch, Ron!  

Look at the google document with all the new rules and see 3.0.1.  The combat phase is broken up into 4 sub-phases.

1)  Non-attack spells
2)  Target Selection
3)  Javelins/Pila
4)  All other combat including ranged attacks and attack spells.

Everything in a given subphase is considered simultaneous, even though traditionally the attacker rolls first.

At the moment, pixies would fire during "all other combat."  So for example, let's say a unit of Owlbears is final rushing some Umenzi Javelineers who are also being targeted by pixies, and that the Owlbears started the turn 4.75" away from the Javelineers (so that the Javelineers get a throw).  The order would go:

- Owlbears makes their final rush.
- Javelineers throw javelins at the Owlbear
- Owlbears & Pixies & Javelineers all attack "simultaneously."

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This would of course imply that the Poison never has any effect, except on post-rout free attacks.  That's clearly not what Brook meant.  The obvious solution is to have the pixies fire during the javelin subphase.  Doing so would imply in the above example that the Javelineers engaged attack would take the penalty, but its javelin throw would not.

[RushAss]

  I've played the army 2 times so far and it seems to be pretty fun. 

Actually, it was 3 games.  The one against Rob, the one against me, and the one against Chris' Undead.  Speaking of which, here's pics from that game.  Brook will have to provide details.

First turn


Close up of the Gnomes


Early engagement


Later engagement


End game


Clark G the Dog