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Author Topic: 3000 points per side with lots of Elves, some Mercs, and a Stinky Giant Dude  (Read 441 times)
RushAss
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« on: January 31, 2012, 10:45:14 am »

This was the second game we played last Friday night, so we made it 3000 points per side with no terrain this time around.  I got to control the large army while Brook and Chris got 1500 points each.  Again, the deployment zone allowed for 10 units in width.

For this game we tried out a sugar cube house rule for large units.  This rule simply gives large units a (+0) +1/+0 bonus on the charge turn only.  It was an interesting experiment.

Set Up



Monsters and Mercenaries played by Brook, Elves of Ravenwood played by Chris
From top to bottom:
2 Wildmen Horse Archers
Hill Giant (Hits like 5 ton sledgehammer)
3 Wildmen Swordsmen (Will you be brave if we pay you?)
3 Ravenwood Swordsmen
Treant (this is his favorite band - http://www.themaneatingtree.com/ )
Wildmen Swordsmen

Stag Cavalry and a Wolf Pack where behind the right flank (Chariot Food)

This was an interesting build because they had a lot of firepower on the flanks, but the center was squishy-soft.

High Elves played by your humble narrator
From top to bottom:
Battle Squad (Go out there and be somebody!)
HE Knights
Cygnets backed by Archers
Cygnets
Celestial Guaaaaaaarrrrddddd!
3 High Elven Swordsmen
Battle Squad backed by The Chariots of Doom

I knew I would have a tough time creating a 10 unit line, so I gambled and tried to commit most of my firepower to 1 side while the other side would simply need to hold out for a couple of turns so my breakthrough guys could do their thing.  Since I didn’t know what either of my opponents would bring (a line of Ogres would have made me very sad), I committed to focus on the Ravenwood side because my line units matched up well to most of Ravenwood’s units.  I would depend upon the Battle Squad on my far right to do spectacular things tying up the Horse Archers and Hill Giant and I was hoping my Knights could one-shot a Wildmen Sword unit so that they could then flank the Hill Giant.  This wouldn’t quite work out, but I had some spectacular stuff occur on my left that more than made up for it.

Standing Orders

If I’m not mistaken, all of my opponents units had a generic close objective as did most of mine.  My Archers where shooting at the Wildmen Swordsmen closest to them, which would be facing Cygnets.  In hindsight I should have shot at the Wiildmen that the Knights Charged. You see that lonely little blue bead up top in between  the lines?  That was the Hold objective of my Battle Squad.  I wanted them to gum up the works for the Giant and his Horse Archer friends.  No biggie, right?  That’s only 5 times what my unit was worth anyways…

Early Turns


This was taken during the High Elven turn.

Brook liberally applied spoils to his Wildmen, and the one that was about to be charged by the Knights got 2 spoils boxes.  My archery netted me a point or two on the way in.  

From top to bottom:  
My Battle Squad is about to arrive at the point where it plans to be slaughtered.  Fortuately, I only took a point of damage from the Horse Archers.  I played an attack Storm to achieve maximum carnage this turn.  My Knights rammed into the Wildmen Swordsmen and I played a red command card which blasted them right into the yellow.  Their courage check was very poor since even 2 spoils boxes couldn’t prevent the route, but Brook played an Ordered Retreat.  I Sprinted the Celestial Guard so I could have an early engagement with their Ravenwod Swordsmen opponents, but I only got 2 damage on the charge turn.  I did the same with one of  my HE Swordsmen and this unit actually did better.  I direct controlled the HE Swordsmen facing the Treant to keep them from final rushing Mr. Tree which had gotten a little ahead of the Ravenwood line on this turn.  I also direct controlled the Battle Squad on my left flank to keep them back a bit, so it couldn’t get pinched by the Stags on my opponent’s turn.

Mid Turns

Sorry folks, you’re just going to have to use your imaginations here because I forgot to take a pic due to all of the excitement of slicing and dicing.  I had made a slight miscalculation in the placement of my Battle Squad on the right flank and Brook was able to burn the command actions necessary to have his Giant final rush my Knight’s flank with it’s own flank.  The Knights survived the resulting pinch and finished off the Wildmen Swordsmen they had been beating on in the process, but failed their courage check after taking damage and they perished with a whimper.  However, this allowed the Battle Squad to sell itself dearly, keeping both Wildmen Horse Archers occupied for a while because the Giant was obstructing one of them.  In fact, one of the Horse Archers flanked the Battle Squad and I was able to play a red card that forced a route check which the Horse Archers failed!  As they where reformed, the next Horse Archer was able to seal the deal, but that Battle Squad will go down in High Elven lore as a group of heroes.  Both Cygnets hooked up with their Wildmen opponents and did OK.  The one farthest to the right vanquished it’s foe with some help from Elven archery while the other one was able to finish it’s opponent rather swiftly because the Celestial Guard forced a failed courage check on it’s Ravenwood opponent and then they pinched the poor Wildmen.  Poof.  The 2 High Elven Swordsmen units facing Ravenwood swordsmen where able to grind their opponents down while the one that was tangled up with the Treant was able to hang in there.  My other Battle Squad was also direct controlled to keep it out of Stag range.  They then locked up with the unit of Wildmen that where on the Ravenwood side in a rather long, uneventful fight.  The real fireworks (at least for me) went on with my Chariots.  I placed Precision on them and they inflicted 4 wounds on the Stag Cavalry while only taking 1 point of damage in return.  Luck would have it that that Stags blew their courage check and that was the end of them!  Next up was the Wolf Pack which didn’t fare any better as they suffered the identical fate.    

Endgame



Starting from top to bottom:
My Archers managed to inflict the stray point of damage or two to the Horse Archers, who where about to close in and give them the business.  The Hill Giant had flanked 1 of my Cygnets, which died quickly.  Mr. bully then flanked the next Cygnet unit, but I was able to juuuuust reach it’s flank with the Celestial Guard by sprinting them.  You may wonder what the heck happened with the Treant.  It got pinched by 1 of the HE Swordsmen.  On the other side of it, my Battle Squad forced a failed courage check on the Wildmen and I ordered them to engage the Treant on the other flank instead of pursuing the Wildmen.  So now the Treant was triple pinched.  It hung in there valiantly, but as all things like this go, it eventually went down.  When reformed, Brook had the Wildmen face the red hot Chariots rather than have them get flanked by going after the Battle Squad.  I then started Sprinting my remaining line units to the other front.  The game was effectively over now since the Giant didn’t have long to live, I had more units remaining, and I would have 6 command actions per turn to my opponent’s 3 since all of the Ravenwood units where gone.

Final Thoughts  

The biggest thing going for me this game was courage.  Having my Knights die due to a failed courage check was embarrassing, but that would be the only courage check I would fail all game long.  On the other end of things, my opponents failed about 3 courage checks each and that was a big difference.  My High Elven line units matched up really well against the Ravenwood line units and that lonely Battle Squad really gummed up the works on my far right flank by holding up both Wildmen Horse Archers and forcing Brook to burn 2 command actions to have the Giant go after my Knights.  Another thing that helped was that I got a lot of the right command cards at the right time and the fact that HE command cards are awesome to begin was certainly nice.

I’m not 100% sure if giving Large units a (+0) +1/+0 bonus on the charge turn is needed, but it sure helped those guys hit hard on the charge.  It felt right to give this sort of thing to a 400+ point unit, but I’m not sure about giving it to the guys that are floating around 300 point territory.  Still, I’m certainly open to giving it more testing because I don’t mind it too much if a mega-unit gets a leg up.

Heroes of the Game

Ravenwood – Not much good going on here since the courage dice bit Chris this game and his attack dice where not stellar either.  I’d have to go with the Treant for standing up to so much abuse.

Monsters and Mercs – The only choice here is the Hill Giant which caused the death of my Knights and 1 of my Cygnets.  It probably would have finished off the other Cygnet as well before going down.

High Elves – I’m torn between the Battle Squad on the right flank that perished so valiantly and the Chariots that tore through the Stags and Wolf Pack.  They also would have likely finished the Wildmen they where engaged with.

« Last Edit: January 31, 2012, 10:47:46 am by RushAss » Logged

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Kevin
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« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2012, 11:04:25 am »

Awesome!  And the prize should definitely go to those chariots.  To one-shot a more expensive unit, kill another, then be positioned to kill a third unit?   Shocked

Looks like you had a solid plan and line, and, with a bit of dice help, the plan panned out beautifully.  I'm not sure if the Knights were best used where they were, but it was a gamble as to who got pinched first, so it's hard to say.

My sympathy to all those skill-5 infantry who had to go up against High Elves!
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Hannibal
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« Reply #2 on: January 31, 2012, 12:02:19 pm »

Quote
I’m not 100% sure if giving Large units a (+0) +1/+0 bonus on the charge turn is needed, but it sure helped those guys hit hard on the charge.

Interesting experiment.  My feeling would be not to go with the bonus to hit, but instead go with the impact hit.  Its weird because although the impact hit would will result in slightly more damage, I think it doesn't overcompensate in a way that I think the +1 skill would.

First, I'd say that while the +1 skill is not as good as an impact hit, it isn't by a huge amount.  Against a baseline unit, a +1 skill equals +.69 pts of damage.  An impact hit equals +.83 pts of damage.  So the impact hit results in 1/7th of a point more damage.  Not a huge amount, IMO.  Or perhaps more important, if folks feel the impact hit is too strong, then a +1 skill is probably also in that same category.

But the reason I'd be worried about the +1 Skill is that it works a little too well at taking away the weakness of big guys:  mediocre offensive skill.  Usually these big guys can be tied down by, for example, a Battle Squad type unit.  Especially one with cards.  Giving big guys a +1 skill would take away from that in a big way I think. 

Of course, one could certainly argue that an impact hit does an end-around on high Def skill anyway, and that's certainly a valid point.  But my instinct says that giving an impact hit is something that wouldn't synergize well with other cards that could be played on a big guy whereas a skill bump would.  And giving the big guys a little boost but not too much is what I think needs to happen.  I dunno, not really making a point just talking here.


One thing we're in agreement about is that some big guys need the bump and others don't.  That's why we went with the "Monster" route for who gets the bonus.  Things like Ogres and Giants and Trolls would get it but animals (Carthage & Persia Elephants) and Constructs (Wuxing Large guys) wouldn't.  We're still on the fence about Undead (Skeleton/Zombie Trolls).


Anyway, cool report.  I'll get you the Kingdoms stuff this week!
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gull2112
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« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2012, 07:32:04 pm »

I'm curious to know if the +1 skill, if complemented with other available +1 bonuses (flanking, cards, etc) wouldn't be "off" flavor. Besides the fact that it seems to be a rather arbitrary way of acheiving a goal that is much more intuitively handled by the +1 impact.

BTW - Great report!
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gornhorror
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« Reply #4 on: January 31, 2012, 09:58:09 pm »

I'm curious to know if the +1 skill, if complemented with other available +1 bonuses (flanking, cards, etc) wouldn't be "off" flavor. Besides the fact that it seems to be a rather arbitrary way of acheiving a goal that is much more intuitively handled by the +1 impact.

BTW - Great report!

arbitrary definition: Determined by chance, whim, or impulse, and not by necessity, reason, or principle.

You're damn right!!!  Still doesn't make it wrong.  Might even be a better fix than the impact hit.   Grin

More play-testing awaits.

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RushAss
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« Reply #5 on: February 01, 2012, 10:22:00 am »

My sympathy to all those skill-5 infantry who had to go up against High Elves!
Yeah, I'm of the mind that HE Swordsmen are a brutal match up against any of the standard Ravenwood line units.  And while they should be favored because they cost much more, it seems that the disparity is even greater than the difference in points.  Chalk it up to rock-paper-scissors.  I also feel that HE Chariots are a brutal match up for just about any other light cavalry unit in the game.  If you put precision on them you are getting 3 impact hits, which is just crazy.  So even Stags with their 4/1 defense can expect to take about 4 damage on the charge turn unless a defensive card is played, in which case it's 3 points which is still enough to force the route check.  Really, the only units I was worried about in this game where the big guys.

One thing we're in agreement about is that some big guys need the bump and others don't.  That's why we went with the "Monster" route for who gets the bonus.  Things like Ogres and Giants and Trolls would get it but animals (Carthage & Persia Elephants) and Constructs (Wuxing Large guys) wouldn't.  We're still on the fence about Undead (Skeleton/Zombie Trolls).
I like what you say about animals not getting the +1 offensive skill bonus on the charge.  I'm not even sure if Ogres should get the bonus since I find them to be quite fine where they are.  As are most of the Large units that are in that points range like Skeleton and Zombie Trolls.  The thing about the high cost large guys is that it's painful if you suffer some poor luck or you make 1 mistake with them because you've invested so many points.  If one of your Ogres doesn't live up to it's billing, it's not as bad as when a Treant doesn't live up to it's billing.  And that is a problem because if you are going to give some sort of boost to large units, where do you draw the line?  An accross-the-board fix for all large units that can make Trolls worth their cost could make a unit like Ogres or Abominations (which are already quite fine where they are) too powerful for their cost. 
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"The world weighs on my shoulders but what am I to do?"
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