Two rules clarifications -- overkill w/command cards and Hold with location

[Chad_YMG]

Hi All,

Two rules issues came up in my game with Kevin and it's pretty clear that if he's got it wrong then the rule needs some clarification.

The first had to do with how overkill works with cards like Roll with the Blow and Fumble.  At one point I had rolled a five on damage (and no sixes) when I had overkill of one.  Kevin commented that he couldn't even Roll with the Blow since Overkill would turn it back to a five.  (It's possible that I'm reversing the story and he was attacking me.)  This isn't correct.  Overkill converts the appropriate number of sixes to fives as part of the roll.  After that players can still use Fumble or Roll with the Blow to modify the roll.  Any "unused" Overkill goes unused...it doesn't stick around waiting to trump command cards.

The second issue came up with a unit on Hold with a location objective.  The rules currently states that a unit with a location objective reverts to its basic order as soon as it reaches the location and then also states that a unit on hold gets to maneuver on the turn after it reaches its objective.  Kevin interpreted this to mean that the unit would stop the moment it got to the objective and would only maneuver when its next turn started.  This is not the intent -- the intent is that a unit can use whatever movement it has left on the turn it arrives at its objective and then can continue to move the following turn, provided that it remains on the objective.  The extra turn is there because sometimes the current turn isn't enough and we didn't want a unit to get stuck because it just barely reached its objective and thus couldn't reform without spending an extra CA.

[Hannibal]

Huh, interesting.  Well I for one have played as Kevin has, so you can count me in too for misunderstanding the rules.

[gull2112]

Interesting indeed. I don't know that either has come up in a game I was playing. I know I've never bothered to use spare overkill sixes, I don't think I've ever tried using a card in an overkill situation...maybe I have, not sure.

I also rarely use terrain objectives, and when I do I've always just stopped when I hit it and reformed in whatever direction I wanted and then was done with it. It is not that I thought that was the way the rule worked, but because that was simplest and most straight forward mechanic, and since I don't try to do "funny" stuff with it, it has never been a problem.

I'm not trying to argue a point, just commenting that thios is how one person does it.

[Niko White]

I didn't actually know the second one, so that one is an ancient misunderstanding.

[rog5]

Hmmm...also played the way Kevin did concerning Hold w/location objective.

[BubblePig]

I started playing hold with an objective as Kevin did, then for a very brief amount of time played it as Chad explained it (after watching some of his games at the first Championship Tournament,) but soon everyone was telling me that was not the way I was supposed to play. Do I get a consolation cookie or something for being denied my rightful movement-after-reaching-the-objective?

[Manchu8990]

Here are the cookies

[BubblePig]

Nice cookies. 

[gornhorror]

MMMMM, MMMMM   are those cranberries I see in the cookies?  Yum.   Can we make those cookies the terrain objective for the Orc Trolls?  Once eaten, they will receive a (+1) +1/+0 +0/+1.  Perfect!!!!!  Just what they need.

[gull2112]

Were we to clarify it, this Hold with an objective rule makes more sense. You move to, and onto, the objective and then on the following turn you may move again in any way you choose so long as you don't leave the objective or move in excess of your MC. This allows adjusting for things like a defensive arc without allowing for gamey bounding/teleporting move capabilities.

Elegant, intuitive.

[Kevin]

I just updated the google document.  (on the 2nd rule; the 1st rule is quite explicit, and I was just doing it wrong  )

It's funny.  Having played the other way for years, this will take some getting used to--it feels all too easy to make a unit spin to some odd angle.)  But no worries; I'm sure we'll get used to it. 

[gull2112]

Issue number one is a little obtuse to explain. How is it addressed in the rules?

[Kevin]

The 3.0 rule text is quite clear.  (I just sort of whiffed on reading it...)

For each point your target number exceeds five, you can turn one "6" you roll on a die into a 5.  This applies before command card effects that modify dice.

[gull2112]

Ah, the rule is much clearer than trying to describe a situation where it was misused/misinterpreted. I think I've always done that right, but I can't be certain. These points are good to bring up.