Unit Proposal: Maenads

[Niko White]

So, here's an idea for a cheap "tanky" unit for the Amazons.  I think these are on flavor and also allow filling in a line to take some of the more exciting units without being boringly too good at being a wall.

(Historically/mythologically these were normal women driven to blood-drenched revels by the worship of Dionysus.  I figure in this mythology they hail from other, patriarchal lands, and their deity of madness leads them to the battlefields where they help his chosen people.  They're untrained and ill-equipped, but totally berserk, and if they survive the battle, they recover from madness and are taken in by the Amazons where they can choose their path like other women of that society.)

Maenads - 125 points (Standard)
(7) 4/4  1/1  C -  M 3.5"
3/3/5
Always Close, No Army Ability.

[ZiNOS]

Love the units, love the flavour!!!!!

[Niko White]

Err obviously they should be locked on Close - editing first post to reflect that!  Otherwise there's a risk they'll block for stand and shoot Amazon Archers, not the intent.  Also, that's clearly in the flavor.

[Chad_YMG]

I think I'd actually take the attacks down to six.  I get that they're crazy, but being crazy alone doesn't let you get in more "real" attacks than elite guys with two weapons.

Here's another proposal -- Temple Guardians, the equivalent of secret service for Priestesses:

Temple Guardians - 143 points
O:(4)4/4  D:2/3  R:-  M:L  C:13
4/3/3

Obviously this is designed as a tank unit -- below-the-curve offense and above-the-curve defense -- which may make it too good.  Making them a (5)4/5 or (5)5/4 ups their cost to 202 points, which isn't going to solve the problem, but (5)4/4 is 165 which is still a great tank.  We could limit their use either by making them elite/rare or by directly limiting them to the number of Disciples taken.

[Hannibal]

The Maenads are basically the Choragos...  I mean the choragos could be renamed to Maenads, but they're very similar units.

And still out there that they don't need a tank unit.  Not every army out there needs every unit type.  They have cheap units, so that can fill out a line.

[Niko White]

I think I'd actually take the attacks down to six.  I get that they're crazy, but being crazy alone doesn't let you get in more "real" attacks than elite guys with two weapons.

Here's another proposal -- Temple Guardians, the equivalent of secret service for Priestesses:

Temple Guardians - 143 points
O:(4)4/4  D:2/3  R:-  M:L  C:13
4/3/3

Obviously this is designed as a tank unit -- below-the-curve offense and above-the-curve defense -- which may make it too good.  Making them a (5)4/5 or (5)5/4 ups their cost to 202 points, which isn't going to solve the problem, but (5)4/4 is 165 which is still a great tank.  We could limit their use either by making them elite/rare or by directly limiting them to the number of Disciples taken.

I was imagining them as having improvised weapons, but one in each hand - clubs/sticks, broken bottles a la a barroom brawl, kitchen knives, and so on.  That sounds like (7) to me but (6) would work fine; in some sense the (7) is usually a down-side since you pay a few points for it and not sure it's gonna get much done.

I don't really like the idea of a secret-service type unit with 4 skill/strength; why would you have someone like that and have them be badly trained or equipped?

The Maenads are basically the Choragos...  I mean the choragos could be renamed to Maenads, but they're very similar units.

And still out there that they don't need a tank unit.  Not every army out there needs every unit type.  They have cheap units, so that can fill out a line.

I viewed these guys as complimentary to the Choragos.  I like the (7) 5/5 proposed Choragos version; at (7) 5/5 1/3 they're a regular combat unit - dedicated enough to their god that they've got real weapons, armor, and combat experience, and do this sort of thing regularly.  The Maenads, meanwhile, are driven to Amazon lands and to combat as a potentially one-time thing.  Some will go on to become Choragos, but some will just go off and do something else if they survive the battle.

And I'm not sure the faction "needs" another cheap unit exactly (playtesting is the only thing that would reveal that) but I think they've got good flavor and provide a neat possibility.

[Chad_YMG]

I agree that an army doesn't have to have a unit that screams tank, but I'm not a huge fan of an army that has mostly expensive hitters and then some light/cheap guys.  It can be very hard to field a real line with that mix and if you do there's a big risk that the game devolves into a question of whether your crap folds more quickly than your good guys win...and the answer can pop up on the first turn of combat.

The thought on the Temple Guardians was that rather than being super-elite warriors they're mostly an honor guard and their training focuses specifically on protecting the priestesses. Hence they have solid defensive skill, good armor and high morale.

[Niko White]

I agree that an army doesn't have to have a unit that screams tank, but I'm not a huge fan of an army that has mostly expensive hitters and then some light/cheap guys.  It can be very hard to field a real line with that mix and if you do there's a big risk that the game devolves into a question of whether your crap folds more quickly than your good guys win...and the answer can pop up on the first turn of combat.

The thought on the Temple Guardians was that rather than being super-elite warriors they're mostly an honor guard and their training focuses specifically on protecting the priestesses. Hence they have solid defensive skill, good armor and high morale.

I don't know exactly where this is directed, but my hope was that the Maenads would dodge this issue by being unbreakable; they're not going to create the same kind of tension because they're basically a hit point sponge.  (They're also cheap enough to stack two-deep if you want, especially if we cut attacks to (6).)  But I do think Kevin's point that some cheaper units would be good is well taken, even if I don't like just throwing in battlesquad equivalents.

[ZiNOS]

I did not have time to read through all the units, i mainly focused on the cards.

WTF is a Choragos unit? Choragos means "Sponsor"....

are you sure this was the meaning you intended?

If i tire you correcting you on the Greek names, speak up and we will have this conversation at the end of the faction .

Cheers!

[gull2112]

I did not have time to read through all the units, i mainly focused on the cards.

WTF is a Choragos unit? Choragos means "Sponsor"....

are you sure this was the meaning you intended?

If i tire you correcting you on the Greek names, speak up and we will have this conversation at the end of the faction .

Cheers!

I imagine it feels the same way to you as it feels to us when we get spam with really bad english.

[Hannibal]

WTF is a Choragos unit? Choragos means "Sponsor"....

In ancient Greek theater, Choragos was the leader of the chorus.  It led them in chants and dance, usually posing really plot-important questions and generally setting the scene. 

I envisioned for a fantasy unit that at the Dionysian ritual there'd be a priestess there leading the ecstatic dance of women filled with the madness of the Oathbreaker.  Those that could not return would instead sojourn to Amazon lands.  And so the Choragos would be this unruly mob and chant, stomping, insane women led by a single priestess.

Not a direct translation...but that's why it's called fantasy.   

[ZiNOS]

In ancient Greek Choragos means the leader of the dance (choros = dance). However the leader was the one that spent the money for the exercise of the dance and very soon the word Choragos was used for the rich citizen that gave the money mor the theatrical play (the actors were actually paid by the city state, the chorus were paid by the Choragos).

The one person of the chorus that sometimes speaks with the actors and gives plot hooks and makes the plot go on is called "Koryfaios" literraly meaning "the first one, the one on the top".

Check it out.

Cheers!

[Hannibal]

Check it out.

Yeah, I did.  Deliberately went with the name.  It sounds vaguely like 'chorus' while still sounding exotic enough to the English speaker that we could do what we wanted.

[ZiNOS]

...whatever.

Just the first search a player will do is this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Choragos

..and then you get the Choregos=?=sponsor description.

[Hannibal]

...whatever.

Just the first search a player will do is this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Choragos

I'm utterly confused by how this is a problem.  It's a fantasy faction.  I doubt anyone will run to their computer to fact-check the names.  And if they do, I'm willing to bet people will be okay with a little bit of extrapolation to have a cool-sounding name.  The fact that it happens to be a Greek name is the only reason you noticed.

Seriously, I don't get it.  Heck in Persia vs Alexander, the name we used for the skirmisher archers is not the technically proper name.  Its extrapolation on our part to keep a cool sounding name.