The Chad Ellis Ravenwood Review

[gornhorror]

Over the last weekend at Dexcon, while playing the Ravenwood elves,  Bohan noticed that when one of my Wolfkin routed, it was able to rally at the end of the turn.  Bohan told me that he didn't think that was right.  He originally thought that when a wolfkin or wolf pack routs that it reforms at the beginning of the NEXT TURN.  I then looked at the errata of the card and it said that it rallies at the end of the current turn.  Is this correct?  It was funny, Bohan thought that this was too powerful for the 179 and 146 point cost respectively.  and I quote....."that makes them better than skirmishers......."

[Hannibal]

That is correct, to my knowledge.  And they pay for it too...   

[gull2112]

I've been sayin' this ever since I've been playing Lazyj, those damn wolfkin are broken! Actually, that's only true under two specific conditions:
1. Lazyj is the player.
2. I'm the other guy and I've got some crazy ass orc build.

This is all in jest. The wolfkin are definitely not broken, nor are they over priced. They are very effective vs. an opponent who "gets" them and how to use them. Also, you cannot buy a whole army of them, or even a simple profusion of them, and expect that if a little goes a long way then a lot should be awesome sauce. In proper amounts, in proper situations, used properly, they can be very effective. This is one of the subtle aspects about this faction and this game that makes BG so enjoyable.

[gornhorror]

I've been sayin' this ever since I've been playing Lazyj, those damn wolfkin are broken! Actually, that's only true under two specific conditions:
1. Lazyj is the player.
2. I'm the other guy and I've got some crazy ass orc build.

This is all in jest. The wolfkin are definitely not broken, nor are they over priced. They are very effective vs. an opponent who "gets" them and how to use them. Also, you cannot buy a whole army of them, or even a simple profusion of them, and expect that if a little goes a long way then a lot should be awesome sauce. In proper amounts, in proper situations, used properly, they can be very effective. This is one of the subtle aspects about this faction and this game that makes BG so enjoyable.

I agree that the wolf packs and the wolfkin are great units if played properly.  I seem to have a lot of success with them lately.  I played this army over the weekend against Tim(GoIndy):

4 wolfkin
2 wolf packs
2 stag cavalry
1 treant

The army is surprisingly effective.  Nothing moves slower than 5" and 6 out of the 9 units auto rally at the end of the turn after routing, which can save your ass.  It saves command actions and stops the whole autokill the routing unit thing. 

[RushAss]

This is the game and army Brook speaks of:



He's been sitting on it for a while.  When he first told me about it I thought it was neat, but I also thought that it would have a tough time against a solid infantry line type army if the flanks are refused.  So a situational army, then.  Lo and behold, Tim fields a stand and shoot build which was perfect for these guys!  I'm still wondering how the hell Goblin Spearmen took out a unit of Stags in that game...

[gornhorror]

This is the game and army Brook speaks of:



He's been sitting on it for a while.  When he first told me about it I thought it was neat, but I also thought that it would have a tough time against a solid infantry line type army if the flanks are refused.  So a situational army, then.  Lo and behold, Tim fields a stand and shoot build which was perfect for these guys!  I'm still wondering how the hell Goblin Spearmen took out a unit of Stags in that game...

I think that the wolfkin can hold up pretty well for the most part because of their routing bonuses and their auto rally ability.   Hopefully with all of the speedy units(wolf packs, and stags cavalry) you can gain the advantage on the sides of the battle line.  Also, don't forget about the Treant.  Put spirit guidance on him, and save some command cards to boost offensive skill and he might break through too!!!

[RushAss]

I think that the wolfkin can hold up pretty well for the most part because of their routing bonuses and their auto rally ability....

...Also, don't forget about the Treant...

They are quick and the auto rally thing is a lifesaver, but what if they don't route?  Between their flimsy stat bar and 2/1 defense they will get hacked to pieces by most comparable line units.  I like the Wolfkin, but I don't think I would ever depend on them to stand up as line units in the conventional sense.  I agree that the Treant is your golden goose here along with the Stags.  Those are the 3 guys that you can expect to get the most damage out of, as well as longevity as long as you don't ram the Stags head-on into a solid opponent.  That's the Treant's job

[gornhorror]

I think that the wolfkin can hold up pretty well for the most part because of their routing bonuses and their auto rally ability....

...Also, don't forget about the Treant...

They are quick and the auto rally thing is a lifesaver, but what if they don't route?  Between their flimsy stat bar and 2/1 defense they will get hacked to pieces by most comparable line units.  I like the Wolfkin, but I don't think I would ever depend on them to stand up as line units in the conventional sense.  I agree that the Treant is your golden goose here along with the Stags.  Those are the 3 guys that you can expect to get the most damage out of, as well as longevity as long as you don't ram the Stags head-on into a solid opponent.  That's the Treant's job

Marcus,  this is me your talking about.........My wolfkin will rout in everygame I play......guaranteed.     So there is no worries there.  The attack profile of the wolfkin are still pretty comparable to most regualr line units.....but yeah, they are a bit more fragile than most.  The 5" move will let them take advantage if a break in the opponents line occurs, and you will be playing command cards on them like crazy because you don't have to use command actions rallying or saving their ass if they do rout.   

Did I tell you? I like Ravenwood.........even better now because of the new ranged rules and my new appreciation for the Wolfkin and Wolf Packs.

[gull2112]

Seeing that game and commentary I now know why James likes the wolfkin so much. He absolutely cannot pass a critical rout check! Solution: Use guys that are designed to rout!
Actually, where they work exceptionally well is in the flank refusal department, especially since they can race ahead with their 5" MC and pin down the haplessopponent, all the while refusing the flank. The other thing they do uncomfortably well is provide pinches, with which I'm all too familiar.

I've never seen James's theoretical super wolfkin army, where he refuses both flanks, a tactic he calls the "Reverse Double Envelopement...Although I think that tactic is actually called a "total rout."

[Jatha]

Bear Pack.  I wish we'd made these guys so that the Command Card restriction wasn't absolute.  It hurts them; they're a fine unit, but you really want them to muscle through and not being able to play cards really hampers this.

I don't like taking these guys in my builds. Being 300 points, and the inability to boost their stats with cards pretty much guarantees them a spot on the bench every battle.

That being said, a few days ago I was playing a friend using the High Elves and I decided to give them another chance to impress me. Then I was forced to watch as his Bowriders peppered my Bears for 3-4 damage before destroying them with his knights, while the bears inflicted a grand total of one damage.
Afterward I mentioned the bearpack's weak performance, and we both agreed the bears should be considered Fearsome, which might help make up for the lack of command cards.

[RushAss]

Looks like those bears got finessed to death.  I personally wouldn't use them against High Elves because they only have an offensive skill of 5, but they are great against Hawks, Orcs, Dwarves, Undead, and Lizardmen.  The combination of that fat stat bar, 14 courage, and reasonable defense makes them a tough unit to take down without receiving significant damage in return.  Next time you see High Elves bring along some archery and Stags  

I think the Bears are fine, but you've got to use them in the correct situation and for the love of Pete bring along Bearkin!  I'm on the fence as to whether or not they should be fearsome, but I have argued in the past that they should possibly be immune to fear checks like the Dwarven Longbeards.  

[Kevin]

I'd like to see bears and wolves go from no cards to dump-a-card-to-play-a-card, like the dinosaurs which the Lizardmen have trained.  Fearsome seems more iffy--only the Dark Elves have fearsome units which aren't large, and the Dark Elves supposedly get it from magical funk.

[Jatha]

Looks like those bears got finessed to death.  

My friend tends to spend the majority of his CA on maneuver mastery (horse archers), so I suppose this was inevitable, but I did expect them to last at least another turn so I could pinch his knights.

Next time you see High Elves bring along some archery and Stags  

The last time I brought Stag calvary against his high elves, I had three stags engage two knights (one twos company, the other head on). I was expecting the two stags to blow through their opponent, then flank or pinch the other knight. The first Knight killed one of the two stags on the charge, taking a total of three damage, while the other knocked the stag into red, which promptly routed and was also annihilated.
Needless to say, I'm apprehensive about bringing stags as well, which is a shame, because I like stags.

[Jatha]

I'd like to see bears and wolves go from no cards to dump-a-card-to-play-a-card, like the dinosaurs which the Lizardmen have trained.

I think the wolves are fine, but it would come in handy (Aspect of Wolf on a wolfpack ).

[BubblePig]

Sounds like you have a problem dealing with knights in general.