Absolute BGFW rip off

[blkdymnd]

http://togentertainment.com/

I would love to hear Chad's take on this or see the draw up of the court papers 

[Ultiville]

Wow, they're trying to get their way into a crowded market, there!

I especially like how they don't appear to have drawn in the health boxes, good idea guys.

I am interested in how IP laws for this work; on the one hand, people can get awfully close to cloning things and not get in trouble (several CCGs have cribbed a whole lot from Magic, RPGs and D&D, on the other hand, this looks, as you say, like a clear and absolute rip off, even down to the style of the cards.

Also, I have no idea why they thought this was a good idea.  Sure, Battleground is an awesome game, but it hardly took the gaming world by storm and flooded YMG with riches.

[Jtolman]

Today T.O.G. Entertainment™ announced the impending release of Shattered Sword Fantasy Battle Card Game. The release date will be announced by mid – October, and will be available to purchase in early November, 2008.

Jim Mauro, President of T.O.G Entertainment™, reports that Shattered Sword Fantasy Battle Card Game is a fast and fun fantasy battle game using cards as units. It is a game for two or more players where each player chooses an army, and the cards represent units in your army. Players can choose their units for each game based upon the point system which is included, or any other manner the players choose. Players can play on any suitable card table or larger surface which represents the battlefield where the opposing armies will fight

Each faction comes packaged as an Army box deck of 54 cards, which contains 24 Unit Cards, 16 Command Cards and 12 Spell Cards. Later releases will include Reinforcement packs for each Army containing Specialty Units, Command and Spell Cards. Mr. Mauro states that, “we have developed a very elegant game system that emphasizes playability, while at the same time implementing a system that recreates the friction and uncertainty of Command on the battlefield. Above all, the game is designed to be fast paced and fun to play”.

You can visit the website at http://www.togentertainment.com for more exciting details and upcoming release dates for future army decks. Dealer and Distributor inquiries are welcomed, please visit the website forums to stay up to date on all T.O.G. Entertainment news.

I do think they crossed a line, as far as coming to close.  I mean the look of the cards, even though they don't print out every Hitpoint.. they even use the sae colors for hitpoints and the text of their "Announcement" shows CLEAR violations....."Shattered Sword Fantasy Battle Card"  this name has very familiar sounds to it.

Army box deck of 54 cards, which contains 24 Unit Cards, 16 Command Cards and 12 Spell Cards. Later releases will include Reinforcement packs for each Army containing Specialty Units, Command and Spell Cards.

Command cars?  Geeze that's not a clear rip off even with the addition of spell cards.  Reinforcment decks? again even a complete Rip off of the selling model. 

These guys truly deserve a Major smacking down.

Chad? IF you have ANY questions about copyright laws and wether something is a violation, You ought to contact David Kenzer of Kenzer & company. He is a great guy and a Copyright Lawyer in addition to being a Game designer himself.

[Jtolman]

I do have to wonder if the Moron isn't trying to start something though.. Note his Name on their Forums.

TOG Troll 2

Troll?  or trolling? perhaps?

[blkdymnd]

I just looked again and noticed that they even appropriated the little red lines on the center points of the card sides... geez...

I just used their contact us link to ask them if it was intentional to make a virtual visual copy of an already very established game called Battleground: Fantasy Warfare.  I'll relay their response here if I indeed receive one.

[blkdymnd]

The TOG Troll posted this on his forum:

"There seems to be some concern that SSFBCG (Shattered Sword Fantasy Battle Card Game) is similar to another game on the market. In an effort to clear up that misconception we have posted the Turn Sequencing of the game as well as two sample turns. You can find them on this page http://togentertainment.com/index.php?main_page=page&id=10

You will see that the only similarities are that they are card games and use a top down view of each unit and dice.
Thanks

Troll 2"

But conviently you cannot post a reply in the Shattered Swords General Discussion forum, so my rebuttal will have to wait i guess.

[Jtolman]

I tried to register ... and did so.. but I could not log in eve after it said i should have been able to
so no way to post for me either.

ONLY similiarities lol SURE.. except for all the art work card design and command cardds and trying to call them action points rather than command points

[Ultiville]

So...the turn order is different, but the mechanics are overcomplicated versions of very, very similar things?  I notice he is talking about using Command Actions Control Points to draw cards, and to make his units move (though if he doesn't they get a roll to see if they do; I love luck in my command and control!  I'm glad this looks like not just a rip off but a worse version.)  Anyway, even his "response" makes it look like an awfully similar basic idea with some strangeness put in and murky modifiers to make high dice rolls good.

Also doesn't seem to get that "look and feel" are IIRC quite important to things like branding.  I haven't seen the back of the card but that front is lifted straight off of Battleground and made more ugly, right down to the locations of the bars, colors of the health, and the arrangement of the troops.

I have no idea if a legal challenge could be effective, but I'm still astounded anyone thinks that they'll make any money as a small start-up company poaching from this particular market.  I just hope that if legal action can't happen, his shenanigans don't hurt Battleground's market.

(I don't seriously credit the idea that the guy independently developed this -- there are just way, way too many similarities going on here for it to reasonably be anything other than straight-up poaching; at the most generous it is "inspired and heavily influenced" but I'm leaning more towards "crassly ripped off with enough modifications that the publisher hopes they cover his butt.")

[blkdymnd]

And you know, if he came out and said, "This game, though different in mechanics, was inspired by what Battleground and Your Move Games have done before me"

Or at least have some sort of homage to the game your stealing from, it would still raise my hackles, but not quite as bad as trying to pawn off that this was his development completely.

[Ultiville]

Heck, if he wanted to make a fantasy cards-as-units game with hugely different mechanics and card layout then that'd be fine, I think he'd be being silly and doomed not to make enough money, but it'd be morally fine.  But his "example" actually made me more upset -- cribbing command cards and points to take control of your guys and the like is pretty crass.  As even just an amateur designer, I'd scrap that one as being too close, let alone trying to actually sell it.

[ajax98]

It all reads a bit too chitty and fiddly to me to be taken seriously. As the saying goes, Imatation is a strong form of flattery. It really seems that he wanted to have leaders/wizards and more "magic" involved with the combat systems.
 
eh...
Kinda reminds me of Wyvern, in the vein of "me too!"

[blkdymnd]

TGN just reported a change in their card design, which is a nice gesture though it's still pretty similar at least it's not a dead ripoff anymore.  And if you go to the TOG site, they have the new cardstyle posted already.  They must have been scrambling today to come up with that that quick.

[Jtolman]

wouldn't be surprised if whoever it is has an account on these forums or visits here at least.

[Jtolman]

and the change wasn't much of one.... it still resembles BGFW way to much.  and the rules aren't all that different. just a different order of activity and some other additions.

[blkdymnd]

"The similarity to another card game is that they both use cards and top down view of the
units."

This part just infuriates me that the guy has the cohones to say that it was because it was just "top down" view and not "I ripped off every part of the card, the only thing I changed was the hit points into 3 boxes instead of laying them out in a row". 

And whether he used CG or not is irrelevant, it was a carbon copy of a BG card.  Well, the positive thing that TGN inadvertantly "outed" him I think may sting him in the end and he'll never outsell this game anyway, nor will he receive any awards as BG has for originality points.