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Author Topic: Open Path  (Read 1405 times)
UvulaBob
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« on: February 17, 2011, 03:53:01 pm »

Quote
1.4.6.3.4 Open Path
Your unit can only final rush if there is an open path to the nearest open side of the enemy unit. For an open path to exist, two things must be true. First, you must be able to draw a straight line from the front center point of your unit to the center point of the open side. Second, there must be a path at least S (2.5”) wide that follows this line and is free of other units or impassable obstacles.

Is a Final Rush possible if the open path curves slightly, but still wholly contains the straight line that's drawn? I ask because I'm wondering if the corner of a friendly that's not enough to block the straight line is enough to obstruct the open path. A 2.5" wide curving path still has a lot of room to hold a straight line between two points.

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gull2112
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« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2011, 05:43:19 pm »

Good question. I've always played that as long as you could draw a straight line and there was never a time that A path was not narrower than 2.5" inches, you were good, but it doesn't read that way.
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BubblePig
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« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2011, 08:39:46 pm »

I've always used the 'when in doubt, the final rush happens' rule of thumb since that has yielded results equivalent to the way that it has been adjudicated on those few occasions when I have had an official type person to make the call. It also avoids the dreaded 'game mechanic flies in the face of common sense' trope.
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gull2112
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« Reply #3 on: February 18, 2011, 09:08:29 pm »

I'm with BubblePig on this one. I have never played in tournaments and I know you have to be pretty tight with the rules, but in friendly Roll Eyes battles I'm pretty much of the mind that close is good enough. If you are roughly 3.5" away then the Final Rush happens. If I am definitely trying to do something wonky, like position my cards to just barely prevent a pinch or something like that, then I say so to my opponent so he is clear on my intention. Cards get too easily jostled and so forth to be overly zealous about microns.
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"Of course, the Goblin Bombchucker is always a solution."
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ajax98
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« Reply #4 on: February 19, 2011, 12:05:37 am »

...
If I am definitely trying to do something wonky, like position my cards to just barely prevent a pinch or something like that, then I say so to my opponent so he is clear on my intention. Cards get too easily jostled and so forth to be overly zealous about microns.

Ditto
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Niko White
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« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2011, 04:24:20 pm »

I'm with BubblePig on this one. I have never played in tournaments and I know you have to be pretty tight with the rules, but in friendly Roll Eyes battles I'm pretty much of the mind that close is good enough. If you are roughly 3.5" away then the Final Rush happens. If I am definitely trying to do something wonky, like position my cards to just barely prevent a pinch or something like that, then I say so to my opponent so he is clear on my intention. Cards get too easily jostled and so forth to be overly zealous about microns.

Yeah, that's right.

The confusion in this rule comes from the fact that things that seem "common sense" when you're looking at them are surprisingly difficult to write down in clear ways.  The intent is basically "don't contort yourself so much that you're covering like 10" of movement even though the center points are within final rush" and "don't final rush through a gap that's only there because someone nudged the table, and probably needs to be expressed in millimeters".  Actually writing that out in a way that stands up to strict interpretation ends up being pretty hard.
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UvulaBob
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« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2011, 05:00:29 pm »

Here's my attempt at re-wording the Open Path rule for my version of the rulebook.

Open Path
Your unit can only rush if there is an open path to the nearest open side of the enemy unit. For an open path to exist, two things must be true. First, you must be able to draw a straight line from the front center point of your unit to the center point of the open side. Second, there must be a lane along the entire path that measures 2.5" wide that is free of other units or impassable obstacles.

How does that sound? I recognize that cards get bumped around on the table, but like most miniature games, I feel like the rules should be written in such a way that if all unit movement were pinpoint precise and tables never get bumped around, then this is how things should work. You can always throw in a bit near the beginning about good sportsmanship and all that.
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Niko White
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« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2011, 05:18:39 pm »

Here's my attempt at re-wording the Open Path rule for my version of the rulebook.

Open Path
Your unit can only rush if there is an open path to the nearest open side of the enemy unit. For an open path to exist, two things must be true. First, you must be able to draw a straight line from the front center point of your unit to the center point of the open side. Second, there must be a lane along the entire path that measures 2.5" wide that is free of other units or impassable obstacles.

How does that sound? I recognize that cards get bumped around on the table, but like most miniature games, I feel like the rules should be written in such a way that if all unit movement were pinpoint precise and tables never get bumped around, then this is how things should work. You can always throw in a bit near the beginning about good sportsmanship and all that.


That sounds good.  It'll still create confusion because the "other units" point is easy to miss but important, but that's probably not really avoidable.  (Ie, if you're 2" away from a unit in front of you, you can final rush one to the side assuming it is legal because you don't interfere with your own 2.5" corridor.  An important but easy to miss point!)
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UvulaBob
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« Reply #8 on: February 28, 2011, 05:29:21 pm »

That sounds good.  It'll still create confusion because the "other units" point is easy to miss but important, but that's probably not really avoidable.  (Ie, if you're 2" away from a unit in front of you, you can final rush one to the side assuming it is legal because you don't interfere with your own 2.5" corridor.  An important but easy to miss point!)

I'm not sure I see what you're getting at with your example. Have there actually been people who've wondered if their own unit counts as something that blocks its own open path?  Huh
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Niko White
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« Reply #9 on: February 28, 2011, 05:47:14 pm »

That sounds good.  It'll still create confusion because the "other units" point is easy to miss but important, but that's probably not really avoidable.  (Ie, if you're 2" away from a unit in front of you, you can final rush one to the side assuming it is legal because you don't interfere with your own 2.5" corridor.  An important but easy to miss point!)

I'm not sure I see what you're getting at with your example. Have there actually been people who've wondered if their own unit counts as something that blocks its own open path?  Huh

Not if they think about it but if you're sitting there trying to measure out the path.  Anyway yeah not really a point against your explaination I just ramble sometimes, carry on Tongue
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gull2112
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« Reply #10 on: February 28, 2011, 07:04:24 pm »

I just ramble sometimes Tongue

I picked up on that within 30 seconds of meeting you. Cheesy
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Niko White
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« Reply #11 on: February 28, 2011, 07:08:01 pm »

I just ramble sometimes Tongue

I picked up on that within 30 seconds of meeting you. Cheesy

Ok, all the time, fine, fine.
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wulfgar61
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« Reply #12 on: April 26, 2011, 10:58:03 am »

I cannot send the attachment for some reason

In the attached file the blue unit is on one side and the yellow and red units are the other side.  The blue unit is up against a obstacle that blocks movement.  So the only open face is his front side.  Both enemy units are within 3.5 of the blue unit.  The line from the center point of the red to the blue unit passes within 1.25 inches of the yellow unit. 

So could the red unit final rush the light blue unit on the left or is he blocked by the yellow unit?
« Last Edit: April 26, 2011, 11:00:00 am by wulfgar61 » Logged
wulfgar61
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« Reply #13 on: April 26, 2011, 11:00:49 am »

The upload folder is full. Please try a smaller file and/or contact an administrator.
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Zelc
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« Reply #14 on: April 26, 2011, 02:28:48 pm »

Wulfgar, try uploading the image to www.imgur.com and linking.

I think the two units might be able to Two's Company, otherwise you should be able to pick which unit Final Rushes first.
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